Gen 3 Insight Forum banner

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
To be completely honest, I'd just love more control over the battery profiles, maybe it's the nerd in me...

I'd love the ability to charge the battery with less gas related energy as well. A solar roof upgrade for example, the battery pack isn't huge and would benefit greatly from additional trickle charging, especially on those long trips with cruise set on the highway.

Nitpicking at this point, but instead of using engine drag when the battery is full coming down a mountain, is there not a better way to use that energy? I'd love a mountain mode, something that prioritizes ev power on acceleration. That'll allow more battery use before a long decline. I haven't had the time to do testing, and I'm thinking I should have done the mountain drive in sport mode, just not sure if that would have used enough battery to keep the car from engine braking. Maybe even something similar to a capacitor to store extra unused energy.

Also pipe dream, but I'd love Honda to data-mine insights for a gps enabled battery profile in the future. Something that takes into account the navigation system for a "maximized" efficiency accounting for traffic and elevation changes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: PHILBERT

·
Registered
Joined
·
158 Posts
To be completely honest, I'd just love more control over the battery profiles, maybe it's the nerd in me...

I'd love the ability to charge the battery with less gas related energy as well. A solar roof upgrade for example, the battery pack isn't huge and would benefit greatly from additional trickle charging, especially on those long trips with cruise set on the highway.

Nitpicking at this point, but instead of using engine drag when the battery is full coming down a mountain, is there not a better way to use that energy? I'd love a mountain mode, something that prioritizes ev power on acceleration. That'll allow more battery use before a long decline. I haven't had the time to do testing, and I'm thinking I should have done the mountain drive in sport mode, just not sure if that would have used enough battery to keep the car from engine braking. Maybe even something similar to a capacitor to store extra unused energy.

Also pipe dream, but I'd love Honda to data-mine insights for a gps enabled battery profile in the future. Something that takes into account the navigation system for a "maximized" efficiency accounting for traffic and elevation changes.
I'll second all that. I came up with that topographical navigation / battery optimization idea a while ago...until I saw Tesla put it into action already for battery range calculations. Probably patented, but might be skirted around by applying the "hybrid" use as a separate application.That definitely would get maximum reserves and efficiency based on what is ahead. Right now it looks to me like the algorithm tries to guess how to handle battery charge/reserve based on torque demand, and so it doesn't always have the reserve built up when you encounter a hill. Then the gas engine has to work much harder when that happens. My battery charging in the valley is minimal, so when I go hill hopping the gas engine starts out working a bit too hard. I try and help this by forcing a better charge in Sport Mode ahead of the hills, but even then it resists fully charging the battery. There is a lot of room for customization here. I'd prefer the ability to program my own.

Once in the hills, it does charge better, but there is another issue that I believe a bigger battery would help with a whole lot. I'm noticing the battery reaches full charge coming down hills and CAN'T charge any more. THAT equals wasted opportunity for energy reserves. That is where more battery capacity would help. To make matters worse, the gas engine begins breaking the car (either with cruise control or without cruise control engaged...no difference). It's like a gas engine in low gear when the battery is full and you still have a lot more downhill grade to descend. A bit noisy, too. All wasted opportunity, and I can't guess how that revving engine effects gas usage.

My thoughts on how the extra battery weight would effect MPG are this...I notice no difference in MPG if my wife is with me, or I'm driving alone. I still get great MPG numbers either way. LiIon batteries are pretty light for the capacity they store, although the metal housing they put these in may add some weight. Where would the extra battery go? The trunk? Might be a good "option" for those who are willing to give up trunk space for battery capacity.

I WISH they made the Clarity an exact replica of the Insight in a bigger sized car, but with the same low-to-the-ground stance. The Volt tries to balance "plug in" EV battery range with overall MPG, but eventually the extra big battery hurts MPG. But I believe having some extra battery reserve in the Insight would help MPG where hills are concerned. And I'd love some extra EV range in town. As far as EV not working at 75 MPH, I actually did see it showing at that speed now that the weather is warmer. And just because "EV" isn't showing, this doesn't mean the electric motor isn't working at high speeds. The Power Flow Monitor indication shows that it does work...even at 110 MPH! ( been there...done that :D ) More battery capacity would definitely help. So would "custom mode programming". ;)

Phil
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
312 Posts
I'll second all that. I came up with that topographical navigation / battery optimization idea a while ago...until I saw Tesla put it into action already for battery range calculations. Probably patented, but might be skirted around by applying the "hybrid" use as a separate application.That definitely would get maximum reserves and efficiency based on what is ahead.
BMW plug-in hybrids are doing this now, too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts
So I remember when the Prius came out there was people modding the battery to be able to get some huge range advantages. While not really looking to mod my car any way...but is there a fringe dodders community that has come up with any battery hacks to give it more range? More curious then anything else.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
1,238 Posts
So I remember when the Prius came out there was people modding the battery to be able to get some huge range advantages. While not really looking to mod my car any way...but is there a fringe dodders community that has come up with any battery hacks to give it more range? More curious then anything else.
Haven't heard of mods for the Gen3 battery yet. Most can get 500 miles from a tank. How much more range would it take to make a mod worthwhile? I'm sure it would void the warranty, so it may take three years before we see someone try it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
I think the single greatest asset would be a plug-in module. Starting most commutes with a fully charged battery would make 80+ mpg a reality for those of us with shorter commutes. After that a second battery, wired in parallel for the mileage people. Dividing the current draw across 2 packs would allow much longer ev use. Downside would be charging the second pack, and needing a voltage regulator, and the added weight. Although many of us have found the car doesn't mind weight.

This would all require software to make it work correctly. I doubt we will see any major "battery mods" until packs start aging out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Another option would be to develop a solar roof, but I doubt there'd be enough impact to justify the cost.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts
I looked at plugins before the insight and they were too expensive for me at this point. Not only that, they weren't as fuel efficient when battery is used up. My commute each way is about 30 miles. So if I could get something that did that it would be great. We have a charger free to use at work...so in theory it would work out. Problem is the cost is about 5-10k more, and if I don't get to the charger in time, others will use it (only two chargers in each building that is full of geeks with lots of cars that can be plugged in). So decided to go the insight route....but it's always cool to think of new idea.

I think the single greatest asset would be a plug-in module. Starting most commutes with a fully charged battery would make 80+ mpg a reality for those of us with shorter commutes. After that a second battery, wired in parallel for the mileage people. Dividing the current draw across 2 packs would allow much longer ev use. Downside would be charging the second pack, and needing a voltage regulator, and the added weight. Although many of us have found the car doesn't mind weight.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
For clarification, I meant a module that would allow Insight owners to "plug-in" and charge the current battery while the car was parked.

It would have to be a "smart" charger, something that would work with standard 110v or 220v outlets, that regulated charging current, and honestly, I'd like to see it cut-off at 80% charge. We know that charging to 100% is unhealthy for li-ion batteries, unless the charge is to be used rather immediately.

It would also have to take into account battery temperature, and suspend charging to keep the battery under 100*F. The ultimate solution would be something that provided power to the electric a/c unit and charged the battery. It would activate the a/c when needed to cool down the battery pack.

Sorry for the long-winded response, you get the electro-geek in me going.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts
Yeah a plug in mod would be cool. There are good chargers these days that are 110V that could work as well and change pretty quickly.

I like the cooling the battery while charging...makes sense to keep it at a certain temperatures. I fly drones and know the woo's of a battery the overheats and explodes. So would like to avoid that with my car battery.

For clarification, I meant a module that would allow Insight owners to "plug-in" and charge the current battery while the car was parked.

It would have to be a "smart" charger, something that would work with standard 110v or 220v outlets, that regulated charging current, and honestly, I'd like to see it cut-off at 80% charge. We know that charging to 100% is unhealthy for li-ion batteries, unless the charge is to be used rather immediately.

It would also have to take into account battery temperature, and suspend charging to keep the battery under 100*F. The ultimate solution would be something that provided power to the electric a/c unit and charged the battery. It would activate the a/c when needed to cool down the battery pack.

Sorry for the long-winded response, you get the electro-geek in me going.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Waiting for someone to take a Plug in clarity, and merge it with an insight.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
38 Posts
Haven't heard of mods for the Gen3 battery yet. Most can get 500 miles from a tank. How much more range would it take to make a mod worthwhile? I'm sure it would void the warranty, so it may take three years before we see someone try it.
When I fill up the tank the range shows 399 miles. When you fill up it shows 500? One time I tried to top of the tank to see if it would increase the range and it made the powerflow map on the touch screen show nothing until I drove and brought the gas level down a little.:surprise:
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
4,088 Posts
When I fill up the tank the range shows 399 miles. When you fill up it shows 500? One time I tried to top of the tank to see if it would increase the range and it made the powerflow map on the touch screen show nothing until I drove and brought the gas level down a little.:surprise:
The Range distance calculation is based on "current fuel economy" multiplied by amount of fuel in tank (less 1.6 gallons). The range will go up/down during a drive as your fuel economy improves/decreases, and the car calls "0 miles left" at 1.6 gallons.

Check out these threads for discussion on range calculation:
https://www.gen3insight.com/forum/266-2019-honda-insight-range-mpge-economy/2132-gas-tank-capacity.html
https://www.gen3insight.com/forum/7-2019-honda-insight-general-discussion/2324-how-accurate-insights-calculated-range.html

And these threads for 1.6 gallons left in tank at 0 mile range:
https://www.gen3insight.com/forum/7-2019-honda-insight-general-discussion/450-remaining-miles-gas-tank-indicators.html
https://www.gen3insight.com/forum/7-2019-honda-insight-general-discussion/2620-dangerous-territory-have-you-ever-been-completely-below-slash.html
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
The range displayed is based off a calculation of your previous tank average multiplied by 9ish. If I remember correctly.

I have noticed that as well. The power-flow doesn't always update with the addition of gas, occasionally I'll add 91-93 ethanol free (under 2 gallons) to the tank, and the range doesn't change.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
4,088 Posts
The range displayed is based off a calculation of your previous tank average multiplied by 9ish. If I remember correctly.

I have noticed that as well. The power-flow doesn't always update with the addition of gas, occasionally I'll add 91-93 ethanol free (under 2 gallons) to the tank, and the range doesn't change.
It's more of a live calculation/recalculation based on fuel economy, rather than a static measure from last tank... I've literally "re-lived" the same range number (or it stays unchanged after a drive), if my fuel economy improves enough in a single drive.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
836 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
It's more of a live calculation/recalculation based on fuel economy, rather than a static measure from last tank... I've literally "re-lived" the same range number (or it stays unchanged after a drive), if my fuel economy improves enough in a single drive.
I learned something new... I guess my drives are very consistent then, I've never noticed it going up between drives.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
642 Posts
I looked at plugins before the insight and they were too expensive for me at this point. Not only that, they weren't as fuel efficient when battery is used up. My commute each way is about 30 miles. So if I could get something that did that it would be great. We have a charger free to use at work...so in theory it would work out. Problem is the cost is about 5-10k more, and if I don't get to the charger in time, others will use it (only two chargers in each building that is full of geeks with lots of cars that can be plugged in). So decided to go the insight route....but it's always cool to think of new idea.

I think the single greatest asset would be a plug-in module. Starting most commutes with a fully charged battery would make 80+ mpg a reality for those of us with shorter commutes. After that a second battery, wired in parallel for the mileage people. Dividing the current draw across 2 packs would allow much longer ev use. Downside would be charging the second pack, and needing a voltage regulator, and the added weight. Although many of us have found the car doesn't mind weight.
FYI. If you need a second car, the Ford fusion energi plug in is $35k but comes with 10k in discounts if you lease for three years making it a bargain to have for a lease. I average 64mpg in my 42 mile commute and about 750miles per tank. Takes about 7.6 hrs to charge on 110v and 2.5hrs to charge on 220v. Not as fun as the insight, but a heck of a cruiser with a lot of tech installed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
90 Posts
I looked at the Fusion Hybrid as an option originally....but found it a bit expensive for the features that come standard with the EX. The plugin was way to expensive for me these days, even with the discounts. I'll see in 5-8 years how far electrics have come and decide then.

FYI. If you need a second car, the Ford fusion energi plug in is $35k but comes with 10k in discounts if you lease for three years making it a bargain to have for a lease. I average 64mpg in my 42 mile commute and about 750miles per tank. Takes about 7.6 hrs to charge on 110v and 2.5hrs to charge on 220v. Not as fun as the insight, but a heck of a cruiser with a lot of tech installed.
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top