[IronQQQ]

Brake fluid warning has come on 2X during the last few weeks. Fluid level is fine. Goes away on restart. On the first appearance, there was also a random tire pressure msg that came on. checked tires, it was fine. went away on restart.

I'm thinking it's the an fluid sensor issue in the reservoir or wiring to it.... but that wouldn't trigger tire pressure warning. Unless tire pressure warning was just random due to a bad TPMS signal??

anybody have similar issue. Hate to waste a few hours to take it to dealer. Perhaps should just buy my own OBD-II reader and pull the error code.

 

[Verdier]

I've had the brake warning 3 times since I've owned my car. Obviously check your car, but it seems to be an odd bug that crops up at times. If it bothers you enough then pester Honda about it. Since it will probably show no real problem they'll probably poo poo you away, but who knows, maybe they'll start changing stuff and the error will go away for good for you. The tire one I've gotten 3 times and each time at least one tire was 3 psi different than the other. Again if there is nothing wrong, and it doesn't happen constantly, you can probably chalk it up to a bug. If it happens constantly...PLEASE annoy Honda about it. They get off too easy on problems sometimes and could use a good kick in the pants.

 

[insightfully]

Are there one or more indicator lights or messages that also show in the DII? And if so, what color is it (e.g. amber, red), and is it constantly lit or flashing?

Have you noticed any difference in actual brake pedal travel (harder to operate) or stopping performance?

That you're seeing both a Brake System and TPMS warning makes me think there's an issue with your ABS system. The TPMS is connected to the ABS/VSA sensors, as an indirect/directional measurement system.

If there aren't any performance or pedal issues, it might be worth seeing if a TPMS recalibration clears issues (i.e. resets the ABS sensors?), but remember to ensure that you run for at least 30 minutes at varying speeds to complete the calibration.

 

[andrew28]

I didn't know error messages with a more detailed explanation can show up on the display audio tablet screen. I normally see the errors on the DII only. Was this added with the recently released software update?

I would take the car to the dealership for an inspection so you can at least get it on record for warranty purposes later even if they find nothing wrong. Ask them to check your 12v agm battery health, too.

 

[insightfully]

I didn't know error messages with a more detailed explanation can show up on the display audio tablet screen. I normally see the errors on the DII only. Was this added with the recently released software update?

I would take the car to the dealership for an inspection so you can at least get it on record for warranty purposes later even if they find nothing wrong. Ask them to check your 12v agm battery health, too.

Don't think it's a new add. @Wifey'sInsight mentioned that a "car" icon will appear on the infotainment upper right "notification" area (OM19, pg 315):

Clicking on it brings up detailed info to supplement the DII message(s).

 

[IronQQQ]

Are there one or more indicator lights or messages that also show in the DII? And if so, what color is it (e.g. amber, red), and is it constantly lit or flashing?

Have you noticed any difference in actual brake pedal travel (harder to operate) or stopping performance?

That you're seeing both a Brake System and TPMS warning makes me think there's an issue with your ABS system. The TPMS is connected to the ABS/VSA sensors, as an indirect/directional measurement system.

If there aren't any performance or pedal issues, it might be worth seeing if a TPMS recalibration clears issues (i.e. resets the ABS sensors?), but remember to ensure that you run for at least 30 minutes at varying speeds to complete the calibration.

Haha.. that's a great idea. it didn't even occur to me the car has indicator lights on the instrument cluster. I will ask my wife for a pic if it faults again to see if there is ABS fault.

The pedal is fine as is the fluid level. I disconnected the fluid level sensor hoping to recreate the fault but that didn't result in any fault which makes me question the car ECU or whatever it's called.

So the insight still uses the rotational speed difference between the wheels for the TPMS?

Personally I wouldn't take it to the dealer (waste of my time) but my wife scheduled it already.

 

[insightfully]

Haha.. that's a great idea. it didn't even occur to me the car has indicator lights on the instrument cluster. I will ask my wife for a pic if it faults again to see if there is ABS fault.
[...]
So the insight still uses the rotational speed difference between the wheels for the TPMS?

Yes, the Insight's TPMS is indirectly measured as relative rotational speed detected by the ABS sensors at each corner. Honda switched to indirect monitoring circa 2013.

The owners manual mentions differences in the meaning of various combinations of steady versus flashing, and red versus amber "Brake" symbol (OM19, pp 81-83), which made me wonder what you're seeing. Decoding the indicators on the DII may provide more info on what's going on.

 

[IronQQQ]

So we took it to dealer and got the service advisor that I really despise... I've had him before for my other car... After refusing to even look at our picture of the error screen message because they can pull up any error codes via their computer, we left only to get a call from him a hour later saying they couldn't find any error codes and need to see our pic of the error message. WTH? I asked, can I text or email it to you? "No.. please come in and show the tech." WTF!? As this point I said to my wife, let's just drive back. I've dealt with this guy before and it's not worth the effort to argue this.

We drive back, go in and we see the tech in the shop. Luckily this guy is the lead master tech and he is a complete systems geek and insight expert especially with Gen 1 and 2.

He checked obvious visual stuff but couldn't anything so he moved onto system level stuff but couldn't find anything specific to that error message and what he what he could confirm physically. He had a hunch similar to a 2018 Accord issue where the brake switch activation and pressure on the brake system had a momentary disagree due to switch play. Accord was fixed via firmware to delay the disagree another split second. Sooo he checked the switch gap via some feelers gauges and found it tighter than spec and set it as close to spec as he could....007 inch... On a hunch.

Now.. during this he was also searching for other stuff that could activate the error code and we also chatted about the insight. He showed me the Honda manuals and diagrams in the computer he was using to pinpoint the error and also showing me other non related systems of the car for fun.

It was really cool to see what those guys have access too... Very detailed including videos and car logic.

About the TPMS error... Error of one system Cascades onto the mode of another system to function fully... though no actual physical failure exists. Not surprised and common

Anyways... He didn't find anything conclusive but said he would leave the case open and call Honda on Monday.

We get a call on Monday afternoon and he said Honda thinks it was an old code that was stuck in the system from when the car was manufactured. the fluid wasn't filled yet and the brake as pressed causing the disagree. The fix was a factory reset via the infotainment screen to get rid of any lingering stored codes.

Anyways we'll see if it comes back.

Also spent a lot of time chatting with the tech. He was a big techie.

The tech was also interested in buying the Insight as the systems are interesting.... so he asked us for our opinions. This often gets me agitated and I talk about all the dislikes and blah blah and how the car could have been better without costing more if they just changed the software without an increase in hardware cost.

And we talked about accords too as there was one in the next bay and how much I liked my 2013 Accord the best of 5 Honda's I have owned... And common Accord issues.

Really interesting guy.... And really enjoyed chatting with him.

 

[insightfully]

Thanks for the update. Agree that Honda Master Technicians are pretty awesome in general. I went on a drive with a Master Tech in my older Honda to diagnose issues, and we also ended up chatting about the Insight. Too bad those guys aren't the front interface for customers; sometimes the service advisors just get in the way!

 

[andrew28]

I had a Honda tech get inside my Insight's trunk so he can find a rattle noise. 😅

 

[insightfully]

I had a Honda tech get inside my Insight's trunk so he can find a rattle noise. 😅

Ha, right... this "new classic" video - Brakes squeak and steering wheel noises

 

[IronQQQ]

Issue randomly came back the other day. Wife was sitting in the car letting it idle during lunch break so the HVAC could be on. After 15 mins the same error came on. She didn't take a pic of the dash indicators.

She works that same job again later this week, let's see if the error comes up again and if it does hopefully a pic.

 

[pasei]

Had the "Brake System" light come up yesterday. In the first 50ft of starting the car, I went down a snowy hill with braking + sliding "fun" (LPT: don't go ski with the Contis). I'm guessing the system thought the ABS was not working? My Mazda used to do an ABS check after 20 feet.

Anyways, after 20 miles I stopped, cleared the radar, restarted the car, Went away 5 minutes after that.

 

[insightfully]

Had the "Brake System" light come up yesterday. In the first 50ft of starting the car, I went down a snowy hill with braking + sliding "fun" (LPT: don't go ski with the Contis). I'm guessing the system thought the ABS was not working? My Mazda used to do an ABS check after 20 feet.

Anyways, after 20 miles I stopped, cleared the radar, restarted the car, Went away 5 minutes after that.

Interesting... I wouldn't have made the connection on this, but the owners manual (OM19 pg 82) lists one of the reasons for the amber "Brake System" error message is radar sensor issue. Maybe they're set up to alert this way because of the relation between Adaptive Cruise / radar / braking. Was the lighted amber message steady/on, or flashing/blinking during your drive?

 

[pasei]

Interesting... I wouldn't have made the connection on this, but the owners manual (OM19 pg 82) lists one of the reasons for the amber "Brake System" error message is radar sensor issue. Maybe they're set up to alert this way because of the relation between Adaptive Cruise / radar / braking. Was the lighted amber message steady/on, or flashing/blinking during your drive?
View attachment 6288

Everything was steady orange: ACC, LKAS, BRAKE SYSTEM. Yes the radar had a thick cover of slush on it. Maybe it was just that? Although I had the radar covered before without the BRAKE SYSTEM light turning on.

 

[Lavash]

Everything was steady orange: ACC, LKAS, BRAKE SYSTEM. Yes the radar had a thick cover of slush on it. Maybe it was just that? Although I had the radar covered before without the BRAKE SYSTEM light turning on.

This could cause an error and issue a warning.