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3) the msrp of the touring is lets say round it off $29k im in socal. Why is it that i am seeing the touring trim go for as low as $24,440 in other states?
ca has really high gas prices in general. It makes alternative fuel vehicles more attractive compared to other states that have low gas prices. Low gas price states probably sell more suvs/trucks so discounts are bigger for smaller cars and alternative fuel vehicles.
Great thinking... very true! The states where forum members reported the lowest 27k OTD price on the Touring trim also have the lowest (OK, TN) or next-lowest (VA) gas pricing. And the west coast 'tree hugger' states (plus CT) have the highest gas prices in the US.

If I were a manufacturer trying to maximize profit, I'd totally use this info to squeeze buyers for the highest sales price on hybrid/electric car pricing. Also interesting is that the southern half of the US generally has higher sales tax rates, so states like CA, NV, AZ get hit on both the car purchase and car refueling ends.

(Pricing info is from web article dated 5/28/19. Tax info is from 2017 tax blog.)
 

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Here is a snapshot of the spreadsheet tracking my last few tanks of different types of gas, along with different sources. We all know many factors go into MPG. Since I'm experimenting with 0-60 MPH and 105 MPH Sport Mode, my numbers take a hit from all that. Maybe a column is needed to track driving aggression! :D Still, it's a way to see what gives you the best bang for the buck. I love that non-ethanol gas MPG, but does it really make economic sense? I intend to find out. I do have a feeling that my BP gas will have the lowest "Price per Mile", and if you are trying to save money, that's all that matters. MPG is great, but it's really about fuel economy.

Not sure how this will look copied and pasted from my spreadsheet, but here goes:

BRAND / LOCATION / TYPE / DATE GALS. SALE PPG MILES EST MPG RANGE $ MILE
Combined Energy Montic 90 non-e 6/2/19 9.845 $33.46 $3.399 545.7 55.8 58.6 621.3 0.061315741
Stewarts Milton 91 non-ethanol 6/8/19 9.310 $31.64 $3.398 584.6 60.6 61.3 650.2 0.054122477
Stewarts Milton 91 non-ethanol 6/15/19 9.531 $32.21 $3.379 516.4 52.2 54.0 572.3 0.062374129
Stop and Shop (local) 10% eth 6/23/19 9.565 $25.43 $2.659 453.1 47.7 50.3 533.4 0.056124476
BP Phillipstown 87 10% ethanol 6/30/19 9.004 $24.66 $2.739 #DIV/0! #DIV/0! #DIV/0!

Didn't look too good, so I attached a screen capture.

I'll plug my next end-of-tank numbers into "MILES" and the car's computed estimated MPG into "EST" on my next fillup.

Phil
Wow. I can't get over how high gas prices are in NY! My lifetime cost-per-mile is down near four cents due to Jersey's lower prices.
 

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Wow. I can't get over how high gas prices are in NY! My lifetime cost-per-mile is down near four cents due to Jersey's lower prices.
...and even on top of the lower price in NJ, you also get free labor to pump the gas into your car. What a state! ;)
 

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...and even on top of the lower price in NJ, you also get free labor to pump the gas into your car. What a state! ;)
It has its drawbacks - like the attendant repeatedly banging on the fuel door thinking it's a Civic. The door release takes a few seconds to depressurize. I need to plan ahead. Things would go faster with self serve, but full serve is a nice thing to have in winter.
 

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Wow. I can't get over how high gas prices are in NY! My lifetime cost-per-mile is down near four cents due to Jersey's lower prices.
Roger that on Jersey gas. I often top off the work vehicle on 17 before crossing back into NY. I WISH I could use a 2019 Insight for work. The Escape is hard to get used again to on Monday mornings. :sad:

Phil
 

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It's also crazy how much gas prices fluctuate within NY. Up by me it's currently ~3.00 a gallon for Stewarts non-ethanol. About 2.60 for 87.
 

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It's also crazy how much gas prices fluctuate within NY. Up by me it's currently ~3.00 a gallon for Stewarts non-ethanol. About 2.60 for 87.
The Philadelphia oil refinery had a fire last month so gas prices are heading upwards again. Gasbuddy predicts the second half of the summer will be more expensive since we're heading into the peak of hurricane season.

I just paid $2.60/gallon of Shell regular gas today plus 5% cashback from my Chase freedom card which makes it $2.47/gallon.
 

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it's also crazy how much gas prices fluctuate within ny. Up by me it's currently ~3.00 a gallon for stewarts non-ethanol. About 2.60 for 87.
Apparently the Philadelphia refinery processes 27% of east coast volume. Per this updated CNBC article, the refinery will not be started back up, and the east coast shortfall will come from Europe, Canada, and the Gulf Coast. Pennsylvania (+9 cents) and NJ suburbs (+12 cents) have been impacted the most so far, but it will likely be a ripple effect... so the prices you're seeing in NY may just be the start.

Compounding this further, 1) crude oil prices are up due to Middle East tensions, 2) summer-blend gas is more expensive to produce and the cost is passed to us, and 3) 13 states increased their gas taxes on July 1 (CA, OH, IL, CT, TN, SC, IN, MD, MI, MT, NE, VT, RI). East coast states that are impacted by both the refinery shutdown and taxes will feel a disproportionate increase... so maybe the good news (?) in this is that NY isn't also affected by the tax increase through this time.
 

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Here in San Diego gas prices can gyrate a dollar or more over the course of the year and are currently $3.55/gal. Plus I wanted to have a lesser impact on the environment. So I started shopping for a hybrid in October.
I bet that's why California has a lot of alternative fuel(hybrids/plug-in hybrids/electric) car owners. I paid $2.37/gal($2.17/gal after my discounts) for Shell earlier this week. I know CA gas burns cleaner but does it give the driver any other benefit...?
 

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I bet that's why California has a lot of alternative fuel(hybrids/plug-in hybrids/electric) car owners. I paid $2.37/gal($2.17/gal after my discounts) for Shell earlier this week. I know CA gas burns cleaner but does it give the driver any other benefit...?

We had a refinery problem or two last summer and prices were about $4.50 for a while. It's been higher than that. The number of BEVs and hybrids on the road here is amazing. As for other benefits, I don't know.
 

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We had a refinery problem or two last summer and prices were about $4.50 for a while. It's been higher than that. The number of BEVs and hybrids on the road here is amazing. As for other benefits, I don't know.
California has the highest gas tax in the US at 61.2 cents per gallon...

 

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How come Philly have similar gas prices as Boston right now even though PA have similar gas tax as CA? :confused:
Taxes add to the total price. But there's also the 'base' cost of gas itself. This CNN article reports multiple unplanned California refinery outages in late-2019, which reduced production capacity (and increased price). - https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/08/business/california-gas-prices/index.html

The article also mentions that the higher cost of gas in California relates to the state's stricter air quality requirements, which in turn costs more to produce/refine. There's a specialized process used for California-approved gas, and that cost is passed on to the California consumer.

This news channel also mentions and 'unexplained differential' in California prices in general, which has increased over time - https://www.kqed.org/news/11755264/why-is-gas-so-expensive-in-the-bay-area
 

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Taxes add to the total price. But there's also the 'base' cost of gas itself. This CNN article reports multiple unplanned California refinery outages in late-2019, which reduced production capacity (and increased price). - https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/08/business/california-gas-prices/index.html

The article also mentions that the higher cost of gas in California relates to the state's stricter air quality requirements, which in turn costs more to produce/refine. There's a specialized process used for California-approved gas, and that cost is passed on to the California consumer.

This news channel also mentions and 'unexplained differential' in California prices in general, which has increased over time - https://www.kqed.org/news/11755264/why-is-gas-so-expensive-in-the-bay-area
That last link explains everything. :surprise:


This additional differential is what Borenstein calls the "mystery gasoline surcharge." He says right now it's costing Californians about $20 million per day in higher fuel costs — and $20 billion and counting since 2015.


"We don't know if it's because (gasoline suppliers) are gouging, or because there is some additional cost that hasn't been accounted for and that cropped up in 2015," Borenstein said.


One thing we do know is that many Californians get their gas from big-name brands, including Chevron, Shell, Exxon, Mobil and 76, which charge 11 to 16 cents more per gallon than ARCO, unbranded gas stations and grocery stores like Costco and Safeway that also sell gas, according to the California Energy Commission.


According to a preliminary report from the commission last month, "While this practice is not necessarily illegal, it may be an effort of a segment of the market to artificially inflate prices to the detriment of California consumers and could account for at least part of the price differential."
 

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How come Philly have similar gas prices as Boston right now even though PA have similar gas tax as CA? :confused:
https://www.gasbuddy.com/GasPrices/Pennsylvania/Philadelphia
https://www.gasbuddy.com/GasPrices/Massachusetts/Boston
Even where I live, Albany County has higher gas prices than all of the surrounding counties. I can drive 15-30 minutes in any direction and see as much as a 20c/gallon difference in price.

As to why cities generally have higher gas prices:
Brief research has showed me that the major factor affecting gas prices in Cities has to do with 2 factors. Overhead, and mutual competition. I've always known that gas stations such as Stewarts use price comparison to change prices. The manager literally notes 3 selected competitors gas prices, reports it to Corporate, and then they call with the "price adjustment". Since most gas stations in the cities have very little competition to lower gas prices, they generally set it where it's most profitable.

Overhead, rent in cities is absolutely ridiculous, and a lot of cities also pay their employees a higher wage. This increased cost to operate a business requires a better profit margin on products to stay in the black. Also another side thought but cities such as NYC, where you are being charged a toll to cross into the city, in itself is a price barrier. If you live in Manhattan, you are less than an hour from gas that's 30%+ cheaper, but crossing the GW bridge is going to cost you 12-15$, eating all of the gas savings and on a bad day costing you several hours while stuck in traffic.

Another thing to consider Andrew28 is that Philadelphia is a lot closer to the refinery than Boston, so part of that ~30c/gallon tax difference is eaten up in transportation costs.
 

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Even where I live, Albany County has higher gas prices than all of the surrounding counties. I can drive 15-30 minutes in any direction and see as much as a 20c/gallon difference in price.

As to why cities generally have higher gas prices:
Brief research has showed me that the major factor affecting gas prices in Cities has to do with 2 factors. Overhead, and mutual competition. I've always known that gas stations such as Stewarts use price comparison to change prices. The manager literally notes 3 selected competitors gas prices, reports it to Corporate, and then they call with the "price adjustment". Since most gas stations in the cities have very little competition to lower gas prices, they generally set it where it's most profitable.

Overhead, rent in cities is absolutely ridiculous, and a lot of cities also pay their employees a higher wage. This increased cost to operate a business requires a better profit margin on products to stay in the black. Also another side thought but cities such as NYC, where you are being charged a toll to cross into the city, in itself is a price barrier. If you live in Manhattan, you are less than an hour from gas that's 30%+ cheaper, but crossing the GW bridge is going to cost you 12-15$, eating all of the gas savings and on a bad day costing you several hours while stuck in traffic.

Another thing to consider Andrew28 is that Philadelphia is a lot closer to the refinery than Boston, so part of that ~30c/gallon tax difference is eaten up in transportation costs.
Yep, the further away I get from Boston the better the gas prices. Haven't filled up once at a Boston gas station with the Honda Insight. When I need gas I will check Gasbuddy's heat map for the current prices of top tier gas stations at the towns I will be driving through. I also like using the gasbuddy tool that allows you to see the lowest priced gas stations in your state. It gives you a general idea of if you're paying a fair price at your chosen gas station and sometimes it might be even worth the drive if you're near one of these lowest priced gas stations.

https://www.gasbuddy.com/GasPriceMap?z=4
https://www.gasbuddy.com/GasPrices/Massachusetts
 

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Demand is plummeting due to current COVID concerns (less travel, less business use, fewer flights, less driving, fewer factories running, etc), and earlier this week (3/18/20) the market price for oil fell to its lowest level since 2002.

With this, a BP station in London, KY, lowered its price to $0.99/gallon, according to GasBuddy. The Kentucky gas station is the first in the US to fall below a dollar. There are 16 total states (OK, MS, MI, TN, KY, OH, IN, AL, NY, IL TX, LA, MO, KS, VA) with areas of pricing below $1.50.

Gas prices are also falling due to Saudi Arabia increasing production despite the reduced demand.
 

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That's insane. I can only dream of sub-dollar gas prices. It's been around $2.19 the past couple of days here in NJ.
 
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