[Magikhat]

When driving this car I just want to know. WHY couldn’t they put in a bigger battery in this car that will hold a charge longer. I’ve only got full charge a few times so far and it seems to run out so fast. Why not a bigger battery or maybe two batteries ?

 

[maynyrd150]

When driving this car I just want to know. WHY couldn’t they put in a bigger battery in this car that will hold a charge longer. I’ve only got full charge a few times so far and it seems to run out so fast. Why not a bigger battery or maybe two batteries ?

So you will have a reason to buy a 2020

 

[Mr. Natural]

My guess is that there is a balance needed between battery capacity and charging ability. If we could store more, we would need to generate more. So the mpg gain might not be there with just a bigger battery?

 

[hasarad]

It's not the size of the battery - it's the balance of use and reserve capacity to store extra charge. As Mr. Natural stated, a bigger battery would require more generation to fill it. The current battery is a good balance. You'd never want to purposely fill the battery as the energy used to do that is more than what you'd use to directly drive the wheels due to storage inefficiency/overhead (aside from hill descents). That said, the absolute sweetest spot on the power gauge is the white line between green and blue. If I have a choice between banking energy or being net neutral (without breaking the speed limit), I'll take net neutral every time.

With respect to reaching full charge, it's not something to purposely shoot for. The battery should be considered a reserve to dump excess energy for later use. The goal is to drive conservatively and anticipate in order to grab excess from hills and coasting. Braking costs energy as you spent it to get up to speed (aside from hills), so bleeding it off through braking is kind of like a foreign currency exchange you pay a fee to do so.

I larger battery would only make sense if the generator production was able to be increased.

This is a hybrid, not a pure electric vehicle. It doesn't require a monster battery (along with the weight that goes with it).

 

[Verdier]

I'd kill for an electric model of the insight. I'd have a better chance of finding plutonium than ever seeing Honda make an electric model of the insight.

 

[hasarad]

I'd kill for an electric model of the insight. I'd have a better chance of finding plutonium than ever seeing Honda make an electric model of the insight.

You gotta believe! It'll happen. Maybe not this year - maybe not in 2020, but it'll happen! It also might not be called an Insight. It'll probably be a Clarity FE. Sure, it'll look like s**t, but it'll be full electric. Yeah, um, I'll stick with my Insight. The range anxiety thing still gets to me.

 

[Jose Silva]

When driving this car I just want to know. WHY couldn’t they put in a bigger battery in this car that will hold a charge longer. I’ve only got full charge a few times so far and it seems to run out so fast. Why not a bigger battery or maybe two batteries ?

So when the battery get low does the car acceleration get worse or just the engine gets louder? (Potential buyer curiosities)

 

[Mobilcams]

So when the battery get low does the car acceleration get worse or just the engine gets louder? (Potential buyer curiosities)

It's the same as far as I can tell. Not like my 08 civic hybrid where I was scared to make left hand turns.. The only difference is that you will hear the engine work harder when the battery is low.. It charges up pretty quick though.

 

[insightfully]

So when the battery get low does the car acceleration get worse or just the engine gets louder? (Potential buyer curiosities)

Test drive is probably the best way to get a sense for what it sounds like, and whether it's acceptable to you. The initial pages of this thread on 'Engine Noise' offers some helpful advice from @sleewa and others on intentionally using the high voltage battery down to 3-4 bars, so you can hear the gas engine run/rev to recharge the battery. The LiIon battery charges pretty quickly as @Mobilcams mentioned, but this would give you just a few-minute sense of the battery/ICE relationship and load.

Additionally, hybrid driving is just different from traditional driving, if you're chasing mpg and efficiency. Hills and high speeds (>60 mph) will trigger the gas engine to run... so check that out as well during your test drive. There are some suggestions on hybrid mode and battery management in this 'Horrible Engine Roar' thread, but ultimately the gas engine runs the most if your normal drives include hills and highways. Note that the EPA highway mileage tests and ratings are based on 60 mph, so you'll see higher-than-expected mpg hit at highways speeds above this.

 

[Mobilcams]

Luckily for me I live where it’s pretty flat (or not lucky depending on how you look at it). I can drive 70 and get 48-50mpg without too much trouble. At 75 and above the engine will stay on constantly save for the few inclines we have - that seems to drag my EX down to a measly 45mpg lol.

 

[insightfully]

Luckily for me I live where it’s pretty flat (or not lucky depending on how you look at it). I can drive 70 and get 48-50mpg without too much trouble. At 75 and above the engine will stay on constantly save for the few inclines we have - that seems to drag my EX down to a measly 45mpg lol.

Do you run mostly in Normal or Sport mode to help keep the battery charged on flat stretches? 65-70 mph is about the highway speed I use because it 'hurts' to see the instant mpg drop at higher speeds, knowing I could do better.

 

[Mobilcams]

Do you run mostly in Normal or Sport mode to help keep the battery charged on flat stretches? 65-70 mph is about the highway speed I use because it 'hurts' to see the instant mpg drop at higher speeds, knowing I could do better.

I keep mine in Econo mode 90 percent of the time. Sport mode is fun sometimes and that would be the other 10 percent.

 

[Wifey'sInsight]

To be completely honest, I'd just love more control over the battery profiles, maybe it's the nerd in me...

I'd love the ability to charge the battery with less gas related energy as well. A solar roof upgrade for example, the battery pack isn't huge and would benefit greatly from additional trickle charging, especially on those long trips with cruise set on the highway.

Nitpicking at this point, but instead of using engine drag when the battery is full coming down a mountain, is there not a better way to use that energy? I'd love a mountain mode, something that prioritizes ev power on acceleration. That'll allow more battery use before a long decline. I haven't had the time to do testing, and I'm thinking I should have done the mountain drive in sport mode, just not sure if that would have used enough battery to keep the car from engine braking. Maybe even something similar to a capacitor to store extra unused energy.

Also pipe dream, but I'd love Honda to data-mine insights for a gps enabled battery profile in the future. Something that takes into account the navigation system for a "maximized" efficiency accounting for traffic and elevation changes.

 

[PHILBERT]

To be completely honest, I'd just love more control over the battery profiles, maybe it's the nerd in me...

I'd love the ability to charge the battery with less gas related energy as well. A solar roof upgrade for example, the battery pack isn't huge and would benefit greatly from additional trickle charging, especially on those long trips with cruise set on the highway.

Nitpicking at this point, but instead of using engine drag when the battery is full coming down a mountain, is there not a better way to use that energy? I'd love a mountain mode, something that prioritizes ev power on acceleration. That'll allow more battery use before a long decline. I haven't had the time to do testing, and I'm thinking I should have done the mountain drive in sport mode, just not sure if that would have used enough battery to keep the car from engine braking. Maybe even something similar to a capacitor to store extra unused energy.

Also pipe dream, but I'd love Honda to data-mine insights for a gps enabled battery profile in the future. Something that takes into account the navigation system for a "maximized" efficiency accounting for traffic and elevation changes.

I'll second all that. I came up with that topographical navigation / battery optimization idea a while ago...until I saw Tesla put it into action already for battery range calculations. Probably patented, but might be skirted around by applying the "hybrid" use as a separate application.That definitely would get maximum reserves and efficiency based on what is ahead. Right now it looks to me like the algorithm tries to guess how to handle battery charge/reserve based on torque demand, and so it doesn't always have the reserve built up when you encounter a hill. Then the gas engine has to work much harder when that happens. My battery charging in the valley is minimal, so when I go hill hopping the gas engine starts out working a bit too hard. I try and help this by forcing a better charge in Sport Mode ahead of the hills, but even then it resists fully charging the battery. There is a lot of room for customization here. I'd prefer the ability to program my own.

Once in the hills, it does charge better, but there is another issue that I believe a bigger battery would help with a whole lot. I'm noticing the battery reaches full charge coming down hills and CAN'T charge any more. THAT equals wasted opportunity for energy reserves. That is where more battery capacity would help. To make matters worse, the gas engine begins breaking the car (either with cruise control or without cruise control engaged...no difference). It's like a gas engine in low gear when the battery is full and you still have a lot more downhill grade to descend. A bit noisy, too. All wasted opportunity, and I can't guess how that revving engine effects gas usage.

My thoughts on how the extra battery weight would effect MPG are this...I notice no difference in MPG if my wife is with me, or I'm driving alone. I still get great MPG numbers either way. LiIon batteries are pretty light for the capacity they store, although the metal housing they put these in may add some weight. Where would the extra battery go? The trunk? Might be a good "option" for those who are willing to give up trunk space for battery capacity.

I WISH they made the Clarity an exact replica of the Insight in a bigger sized car, but with the same low-to-the-ground stance. The Volt tries to balance "plug in" EV battery range with overall MPG, but eventually the extra big battery hurts MPG. But I believe having some extra battery reserve in the Insight would help MPG where hills are concerned. And I'd love some extra EV range in town. As far as EV not working at 75 MPH, I actually did see it showing at that speed now that the weather is warmer. And just because "EV" isn't showing, this doesn't mean the electric motor isn't working at high speeds. The Power Flow Monitor indication shows that it does work...even at 110 MPH! ( been there...done that ) More battery capacity would definitely help. So would "custom mode programming".

Phil

 

[mgldan]

I'll second all that. I came up with that topographical navigation / battery optimization idea a while ago...until I saw Tesla put it into action already for battery range calculations. Probably patented, but might be skirted around by applying the "hybrid" use as a separate application.That definitely would get maximum reserves and efficiency based on what is ahead.

BMW plug-in hybrids are doing this now, too.

 

[Verdier]

As an interesting aside the GPS in the touring has a setting for best fuel usage as an option on your destination settings. Probably not as precise but it might be a first step.

 

[PHILBERT]

BMW plug-in hybrids are doing this now, too.

Then I bet they hold the patent. Probably not going to see it in a Honda anytime soon. :sad:

Phil

 

[PHILBERT]

As an interesting aside the GPS in the touring has a setting for best fuel usage as an option on your destination settings. Probably not as precise but it might be a first step.

Interesting...Do you think it is based off of speed, or do you think they considered terrain?

Phil

 

[Verdier]

As an interesting aside the GPS in the touring has a setting for best fuel usage as an option on your destination settings. Probably not as precise but it might be a first step.

Interesting...Do you think it is based off of speed, or do you think they considered terrain?

Phil

If I was a smart guy I think they probably use both bits of info. I haven't tried using it though since I basically don't go anywhere except to work and back. Big blue is better for chore driving on my days off since it's a plug in and I can do everything on battery mode. It also heats without using the engine.