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Discussion Starter #1
I’m actually really eager to see when the software for the full self-driving hardware is released for the Tesla..

Since they recently surpassed Toyota as the biggest auto manufacturer worldwide and there are plenty of model 3s around, I’m hoping to get a good used long range model 3 with full self driving hardware for around 30k?

My biggest gripe with Tesla is modifying anything with the electrical will void warranty (ie: changing speakers, adding amp,etc).

If any of the Japanese manufacturers have an answer to Tesla, I’d also be interested.

plus it would give me a good reason to go solar..
 

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Not the largest car company but certainly the most valuable.

I am really critical on several areas of Tesla. Build quality, software bugs and autopilot.

As for autopilot, I don't think Tesla FSD (full self driving) can be achieved with the current hardware. I only have the basic autopilot and there are tons of issues. For example, I hate it when it phantom brakes when going under a bridge or next to a truck. If wife is in the car, I have to explain what happened. I was in autopilot today in the interstate. went through a construction zone..... Semi in next lane couldn't stay in lane due to sudden narrowing of the lanes and went into my lane. I had to take control of the car and brake and move to left of my lane. I dont see autopilot, even FSD being able to cope with that. If Elon thinks he will have a robotaxi fleet, it will have to deal with situations like that. In another instance today, while in autopilot a car cut me off while cruising around 77 mph. My car reacted flawlessly and braked hard to avoid closing of the gap on the cutting car.

Still, I drove 220 miles today with probably about 130 miles on basic autopilot (single lane, traffic aware auto steer). The software of late has improved and I noticed how well it worked since the last software update. Today I went through construction zones, disappearing lanes, rural country roads, and even mountain and canyon twisties but even in a single lane it is still soooooo far from achieving the Elon's FSD.

I'm ready to go solar (except that I need $8-9k in roof repairs first), even though I barely charge at home. I've calculated a break even after 6 to 7 years for Tesla's small solar system. Ability to consume energy from non fossil fuels is truly amazing. If I get a larger system I can even charge the car at home, which is mind blowing as we have powered cars from non renewable fossil fuels for over a century. No CO2 emissions, no NOx, no particulates. Free juice from the sun.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
are your issues with Tesla’s build quality shared by many other people in your experience?

I think the full driving software will have to be perfect before it can be released as there may be new legislation just for this type of technology..

also, when you mean current hardware, you are talking about the optional full self driving hardware that is 7k extra right on any Tesla right now right? I just took a look at Tesla’s website right now and looked at the features of full self driving and it looks to be near full self driving (the reason I say that is because it has “assisted stop sign and traffic light braking”; not sure what that means (complete braking or semi?)..
 

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The build quality sucks. Panel alignment, interior trim creaks. I drove the insight and model 3 back to back on the same roads and the same speed. The trim is completely creak free in the insight. Tesla reps will say, it's because the car is electric motor driven so some creaks or whatever is more noticeable. I say BS... There are hyrbids that are just as quiet with electric motor but are built better.

Panel alignment is pretty crappy on earlier build cars but still not consistent even today. Paint ha durability issues in certain places. I go to mountains a lot. Parts of my rocker panels are getting chewed up after $25k miles. The bumper paint is soooo soft.

these days all Tesla's have the same self driving hardware suite regardless of trim and model. On the model 3, all the cars have the same computer, screen, cameras and sensors regardless if you have a $35k base SR or a Performance with track package and full self driving which I think is around $65k. The in difference in FSD is really all software. Whether you pay to use the FSD software. Actually you can buy the Model X long range plus with FSD for I think upwards of $90 to 100k and that has the same cameras sensors and computer as the $35k standard range.

I can activate FSD immediately from my phone on the Tesla app by using my credit card on file. It's only 3 clicks away.

Upgrades --> Check box --> Pay with credit card.

So the answer to your question, I don't think Tesla can achieve FSD with the current existing hardware even after paying for FSD software.
5409
 

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The build quality of your Tesla sounds similar to some of the things Insight owners reported here. I think it's just luck of the draw and what day your vehicle was built according to @hasarad. ;) My Insight does have a few alignment issues on the exterior, the paint(waterborne eco paint) does get scratched, and chipped easily. Interior seems normal to me with no creaks or rattles.

FSD would be cool to show off to family/friends and that would be pretty much it for me. I wouldn't be one to buy a Tesla and pay $7k more for the car to drive itself instead of myself. :cool:
 

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Am I the only one here that would pay extra for an Insight built from a Tuesday-Thursday?
 

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To be fair our white insight has some pretty atrocious panel gaps at the trunk lid and has issues with the hood alignment with the quarter panels. It's really apparent when parked next to the white orchid pearl 2013 accord in the garage.

I've compared it to other civics and the alignment quality seems about the same. It's a really downhill quality from Honda.

The interior is well buttoned up though in the insight.

My model 3 dash creaks a bit when the temperature of the cabin changing quickly from the sun or AC. Stuff like that bugs. Rough road will bring out random vibrations. The suspension is stiff and the car is riding on 40 series tires.... But I would think a comparable BMW 3 series would not creak.
 

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The build quality of your Tesla sounds similar to some of the things Insight owners reported here. I think it's just luck of the draw and what day your vehicle was built according to @hasarad. ;) My Insight does have a few alignment issues on the exterior, the paint(waterborne eco paint) does get scratched, and chipped easily. Interior seems normal to me with no creaks or rattles.

FSD would be cool to show off to family/friends and that would be pretty much it for me. I wouldn't be one to buy a Tesla and pay $7k more for the car to drive itself instead of myself. :cool:
I do notice a lot of scuffs on the Insight. I thought it odd for a car with less than 10k miles, if not even more scuffs than the 120k mile white accord. So I wonder if that is from the ECO paint. haven't gotten around to polishing them off yet.

The basic autopilot is quite good and is included now (Tesla added $2k to base car cost last year). That basic autopilot is why I went to buy a Tesla in the first place. I was consistently doing 22k miles a year in the accord, with the car parked for around 6 weeks a year. Before coronavirus I was on track to do about 36k miles in the 3. The autopilot and electric charging really opened up opportunities to drive a lot more.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I’m surprised no one has posted this yet..


Looks like American cars can’t shake the “bad quality” image, even with a behemoth like Elon Musk and Tesla cars..

I will most likely go electric one day , but my opinion is quickly changing about Tesla from good to bad.

I don’t know.. it’ll be a while until I need a new car (hopefully) and in that time maybe Honda will have a really good EV out..
 

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Looks like American cars can’t shake the “bad quality” image, even with a behemoth like Elon Musk and Tesla cars..

I will most likely go electric one day , but my opinion is quickly changing about Tesla from good to bad.

I don’t know.. it’ll be a while until I need a new car (hopefully) and in that time maybe Honda will have a really good EV out..
Hadn't seen that article on manufacturing quality yet, but there's a running joke that the fit/finish issues on the Insight make it very Tesla-like, LOL - Trunk Alignment

I think it will be a long while before we see more EV offerings from Honda in the US. Honda's focus thru 2030 is hybrids and EV's aren't a priority, per CEO Takahiro Hachigo. And the one electric model (Clarity Electric) Honda has in the US was discontinued for 2020. Honda will have 2 EVs in Europe for compliance reasons, but they don't plan to bring these to the US.
 

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I’m surprised no one has posted this yet..


Looks like American cars can’t shake the “bad quality” image, even with a behemoth like Elon Musk and Tesla cars..

I will most likely go electric one day , but my opinion is quickly changing about Tesla from good to bad.

I don’t know.. it’ll be a while until I need a new car (hopefully) and in that time maybe Honda will have a really good EV out..
I don't really pay much attention to awards given out by JD Power. They make money by convincing the "winners" to buy their branding for marketing purposes. Like all those JD Power awards Chevy won and then made into commercials bragging about them for best "initial"(90 days) quality.

 

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I’m surprised no one has posted this yet..


Looks like American cars can’t shake the “bad quality” image, even with a behemoth like Elon Musk and Tesla cars..

I will most likely go electric one day , but my opinion is quickly changing about Tesla from good to bad.

I don’t know.. it’ll be a while until I need a new car (hopefully) and in that time maybe Honda will have a really good EV out..
The Model 3 has numerous quality issues... But it is an absolutely amazing car that will make many overlook those issues. My friends Model 3s seem to have minimal issues compared to mine. I joke that I have the lemon of Teslas.

I basically bought the car for the autopilot and actually didn't know too much about the tech, however after picking it up I realized it was an absolutely amazing car. Most of the Tesla owners I know we're former Corolla, Accord, RSX owners.

Bjorn Nyland has been doing a series of videos on the Honda e over the last few days. It looks to be quite a compelling car and a promising direction that Honda should be moving towards.
Unfortunately it still makes the same sounds as current Honda's. Can't they go back to the Honda beeping sound from the 90s era Hondas?

I've been trying to convince the wife to rid the Insight for a Model Y or a Q3 for months now. Can't seem to convince her.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I was talking to a passenger that was leasing a model 3 today and she told me she absolutely loves the car and is not a car person at all.. I asked if she had any complaints and she only had 1, which was that one of the back panels popped out after tugging real hard on a seat belt.

I’ve had my whole interior taken apart for sound proofing and stereo upgrade and rear panels removed a second time (possibly 3 times as I got a 3rd sub and wasn’t around for install) and pick up a lot of people but never had a panel pop out.

only issue I had was with rear seat frame flexing (but I fixed that)..
 
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